If you have to ask the answer will always be no.  

the_stormdancer 91F  
36 posts
5/16/2019 12:14 pm
If you have to ask the answer will always be no.


When I was a sophomore in high school we were required to take this class called “Interpersonal Communications” as one of our core classes for graduation. We all looked at that as a “bird course”...something you just fly through, because it was so easy and had little homework.

The class taught us about reading body language, about the nuances of non-verbal communication and about focusing on people, places and things beyond ourselves.

On the first day of class I remember Mrs. Miller asking us if we knew what interpersonal communication was. Of course we were all one big shrug. So she says “It's about paying attention to the clues that people around us give that shows how they feel.” Then, to get an unruly and disinterested group of high school kids to pay attention she says “How do you know when someone wants to kiss you?” The class went dead silent for a moment...fidgety...and then one boy said - “You can see it in their eyes.” Suddenly the entire class was hands in the air offering suggestions...”Their breathing changes”...”They lean in”...”They hug you first” on and on we offered their interpretations and suggestions. She said, “That's interpersonal communication.”

Now before you get all excited, this class was more geared towards making us masters of the universe in a VocTech sort of way than it had to do with boy/girl stuff. There was much discussion about marketing and selling and consumer related things that drove us to pay attention to clients and customers when we finally got the that place in our life. It was a sort of fun class in some ways. We learned all sorts of things that semester, but it was very passive learning. We learned to read each other in big and small ways. We learned to pay attention. We learned that we really knew a whole lot of it already...the class just made us aware of what we already inherently knew and why we reacted the way we did to non-verbal communication.

I have had dozens of these sorts of classes over the years on a business level. Teaching and learning how to understand the nuances of body language. Learning how to focus on people and see that their responses are important and not just random movements to be ignored – usually geared towards making money, tbh, but at the heart of it all it's about......paying attention.

That was then.

Now we have “rules of consent.”

No longer do we have to actually pay attention. Now we are supposed to ask permission for every little thing (especially those that are into micro-consent...my god), get signed forms and not think for ourselves or be aware of another's actions. No longer do we actually accept personal responsibility for our behavior with others...now we can just abdicate it completely and ask permission for every movement – who needs focus?

My problems with the way we discuss consent these days is that it is cold...distant...lacks concentration or intensity and is completely devoid of true interpersonal communication. It instills the fear that if one doesn't ask permission for every movement that the “receiver” of said movement is one step away from yelling violation, abuse...or worse yet, the r word (since everything is, dontcha know).

It weakens our connections to one another as humans. Fear replaces empathy and application of self...promotes safety over reciprocity. The blatant need for, particularly spoken/written, consent takes the responsibility of awareness away. “Well, she said it was okay” is the call, even when every nuance of their being was screaming that it was not.

Proponents of consent will tell you that this is focusing more on the individual's desires, because then they have the ability to own every single movement in their sphere of bodily control. I disagree...I think that consent becomes about the giver protecting themselves more than it is about the receiver accepting such. How many people, especially women people, will say yes to a direct question about hugging, touching or kissing just to not be thought “difficult?” Rather than reading their body language and accepting such – let's put people in uncomfortable situations of having to agree or reject the offer. Rather than making the person important and focusing on them...make it about “you.”

And let's face it...it's mostly about women's consent no matter how much the consent police bark otherwise, men are largely ignored in this picture and the people that “they” are trying to teach no-no-bad-touch to aren't paying attention anyway – and won't.

I personally wouldn't want to have anything physical to do with someone that had to ask me if they could touch...hug...kiss me. All that tells me is that they aren't focusing on me at all and that they want to be fed information rather than glean it for themselves. We here on Local Shemale Hookups like to talk about it in the terms of sexuality – why in god's name would I want to scene with, have sex with, engage physically on any level with someone that was so unaware of the nuances of body language that they have to ask if they can do such? We're not talking about checking in with someone mid-scene and feeding off the energy they give back...we are talking about someone turning every aspect of the act itself into being about their safety – not mine. “Are you okay, is this okay, can I do this...are you okay with that?” would make me just recoil eventually and end it...the coldness, obvious lack of focused awareness, lack of dominance (or submission for that matter) driving away the sensuality and heat. It kills intensity and it's beyond not sexy into the damn near dangerous zone.

I think some of this insistence on consent, beyond the political, comes from the prevalence of casual scening (though I question that even in my own head) over dynamic led relationships – and possibly that we spend way too much time staring at screens of one sort or another instead of people. We now struggle with interpersonal communication simply because we have less of it. Insisting on consent takes away the ownership of connection given to another, or taken from another. It kills empathy. It takes away the twining focus people should have on each other (particularly if it's sexual). Imo, it takes away the right to dominate given to Dominants and the right to submit given to s-types. I believe it is stymying our ability to even try to see people. It weakens our natural flow of humanity between each other. It renders the recognition of body language and the divinity of self as almost a moot point.

It might be a good way to jump on bandwagons and sell books and seminars.

End of the day, I don't really care what the newest craze or buzzwords of popular behavior are. I don't care what seminars you've been to that tell you that you must ask before engaging. If you're in my world I will pay attention to you, focus on you, not ask you to sign a consent form (nor give you one) and expect your focus in return – because I see you, think you're important and I want you to see me too.

I won't ask you if I can kiss you...

...and if you have to ask to kiss me the answer will always be no.

Be good to each other,

*~In the eye of a storm(y) one

******

> I understand this is considered very out of the box, anti-herd thinking. I don't block people and all opinions are welcome, but disrespect and ugliness will be deleted and noted openly. Manners are a thing, yo.


"You can't exist in this world without leaving a piece of yourself behind."


the_stormdancer 91F  
45 posts
5/16/2019 12:18 pm

[image]

"You can't exist in this world without leaving a piece of yourself behind."


Pal4Perks 58M  
17 posts
5/16/2019 12:33 pm

First kisses should be a surprise, actually first kisses were meant to be stolen. That's the way I see it. Have fun.


the_stormdancer replies on 5/16/2019 2:30 pm:
I'm with you! If not stolen, at least taken from someone you can feel the chemistry with!

PortValp45 52M
7 posts
5/16/2019 12:36 pm

👍


OrangeM4Fun 43M  
4 posts
5/16/2019 12:37 pm

I get your point but disagree nonetheless. Too many guys this day and age are just this side of rabid mongrels, and without rules they'll err on the side of too much, too quick EVERY TIME.

As you say the worst offenders are not paying attention to what's being taught about consent anyways. But at least that means it's easier to put them in in a cage where they belong.


the_stormdancer replies on 5/16/2019 2:33 pm:
I absolutely disagree with the assertion that men act like mongrels. I have found the vast majority of men that I have engaged with over the 9 billion years I've been on this planet are courteous and aware. There are always going to be assholes, but they are the exception rather than the rule.

I think we need to stop male bashing. It's feminist propaganda that just isn't true.

Paulxx001 62M
8462 posts
5/16/2019 12:53 pm

If it works for you... continue doing it.
New words are added to the dictionary every year. If those words clarify a point for some, then so be it. If you don't want to use that word - don't.
In either case... they're not laws. I'd say they're guidelines, for the less "in tuned". A map for those who never took the 'course'. And if it helps some people... why not?
I'm an excluent drummer. But not everyone has rhythm. When I see them someone who doesn't... I just accept it and move on. Or I might pause and say hello. Everyone has strengths and weaknesses. We can't all... have everything.
Life doesn't work like that.

Words are like meatloaf- they can be sculpted into any shape you choose.
She asked me a question.Handcuffs Or Silk Scarves


the_stormdancer replies on 5/16/2019 2:37 pm:
I think that language is a shifting entity, but words have meanings for a reason...deciding that something doesn't mean what it means because "you" decide it doesn't. That isn't even logical and far too many people attempt that. It's part of why we don't understand each other well anymore.

Consent is not a new "word," but it is a new "social contract" that some would shove down our throats in the advancing of their own agenda. I'm not going along with the herd on this one.

Pay attention, be focused, be PRESENT or...be gone...at least from my world.

YMMV.

redrockrascal 60M
19718 posts
5/16/2019 1:13 pm

When I was in high school, 1970s, we had class called “Interpersonal Relationships” kinda similar to what you described but more general. It was referred to as a hippy class.

Love your attitude.

When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro.

The only thing we have to fear is fear itself.


the_stormdancer replies on 5/16/2019 2:38 pm:
I'm laughing at "hippy class." And I agree with your fear quote!

Thank you for reading and sharing!

JTobin1187 32M
7 posts
5/16/2019 1:20 pm

I wouldn't aske because I don't want to hear no!


the_stormdancer replies on 5/16/2019 2:39 pm:
But you'd know if they didn't want you to before you even leaning in...wouldn't you?

whoisagentj 49M  
5757 posts
5/16/2019 1:30 pm

I think in the beginning, it's ok to ask at first, because you're getting to know each other. As time progresses, I think asking every single time would be a major problem, so I agree with you there. But in this day and age, if a guy isn't careful, jumping in without asking when you are first getting to know someone can cause a woman to quickly change her mind and say no. And the worst thing is if a woman says no, and a guy gets blamed for sexual assault.

Who can you call on to save the day?

Why none other than...


Agent


the_stormdancer replies on 5/16/2019 2:42 pm:
From a personal perspective - if you asked if you could kiss me my answer would be "I don't know...can you?" and then I'd shut down and completely lose interest. You'd never get that first kiss.

Too much caution kills chemistry and spontanaeity.

You do bring up the point that concerns me the most...that men, in particular, function from a place of fear anymore and I honestly can't say that I blame them with the way the feminist movement is pushing their agenda. It's a sad thing and it does definitely confuse the issues between men and women anymore.

pocogato12 66F  
26840 posts
5/16/2019 2:56 pm

Just a marvelous dissertation on the condition adults are in!! If you have to ask me, I am going to say "NO" aswell

(Virtual Symposium Group) use Virtual Symposium Group


the_stormdancer replies on 5/17/2019 12:44 pm:
Thank you...and thank you for reading and sharing!

missthee 53F
3958 posts
5/16/2019 4:22 pm

An excellent topic!
Personally, I prefer to be asked. That's because I am a private and quiet person most of the time, so it's not easy - I've been told - to 'read' me. In high school I was called "Mona Lisa" for my enigmatic expression, neither a smile neither a frown.
I also find that detailed negotiation over sexual matters before I end up in bed with someone for the first time, does a lot to put me at ease. More so than romance, mystery, or being swept off my feet, clear comunication is what allows me to get over my characteristic natural reticence.
Regarding consent, I do agree it's been taken to extremes, when a minor advance - a hug, an attempt to kiss - is treated as a serious consent violation and there's a humongous hue and cry over the poor guy's (or girls' , even) attempts at (sexual) courting .
Not all sexual advances are created equal. Some can be charming or welcome. Some can be indeed crude inconsiderate and worse.
It goes without saying they should listen and adjust their behavior accordingly if the woman says 'no to the advances. However, the art of interpreting "interpersonal skills" on the woman's side, should include recognizing the difference between an inconsiderate creepy consent violator and a person who made a one-time legitimate mis-judgment. We shouldn't dump every 'unwelcome advance' into the consent violation bin.


the_stormdancer replies on 5/17/2019 12:47 pm:
I do understand where you are coming from insofar as needing that clear concise detailing of expectations. It is not my way and would never work for me, but everyone is different and that should be absolutely more than okay! One mountaintop, many roads and alla that.

I really, really like your take about understanding the difference between boundary cross accidentally and just being a dickhead. We have gone to an extreme place that has taken the sublime to the ridiculous, I'm afraid, and that's my bigger concern with all of the consent rules.

Thank you so much for reading and sharing your perspective!

Paulxx001 62M
8462 posts
5/16/2019 4:44 pm

I think you might have the vibe, twisted. The "herd", does not agree. In fact the "herd", agrees with you. So do I.
But the "herd" - is silent. That public "herd", is the one that gets the publicity. The one they put out there. No?
I don't have the patience, to educate. I can twist images and words into ephemeral images, that few might understand. Those that do... well... good.
I don't waste my time with "them", that don't.
In any case... whatcha gonna do? Smack your head against the wall?
Yep.. things are bent , aren't they? 🤔

Words are like meatloaf- they can be sculpted into any shape you choose.
She asked me a question.Handcuffs Or Silk Scarves


the_stormdancer replies on 5/17/2019 12:50 pm:
I suppose I'm a bit of a windmill tilter. I think if I remain silent I become part of the problem. Too many are quiet anymore - and with all the caterwalling of late I can't really blame people. You have to have a fairly thick hide.

I posted this blog on another site that I inhabit as well and expected a great big fallout of negativity. I was surprised...240 comments of people agreeing on some level that the consent rules and issues have gone too far.

Maybe the pendulum is swinging back a little?

One can only hope.

whoisagentj 49M  
5757 posts
5/17/2019 12:22 pm

the_stormdancer replies on 5/16/2019 4:42 pm:
From a personal perspective - if you asked if you could kiss me my answer would be "I don't know...can you?" and then I'd shut down and completely lose interest. You'd never get that first kiss.

Too much caution kills chemistry and spontaneity.

You do bring up the point that concerns me the most...that men, in particular, function from a place of fear anymore and I honestly can't say that I blame them with the way the feminist movement is pushing their agenda. It's a sad thing and it does definitely confuse the issues between men and women anymore.


See I do agree with you there. Me? I wouldn't ask permission. I think given the time if we spent it together, there are some clear signs for a woman to give that even the man who's not the sharpest tool in the toolbox could pick up, and I think I'm intelligent enough to know when a woman is giving you those signs, such as looking deeply into your eyes, touching you, holding your hand, hands around your waist, stuff like that. A man should be ok with those things.

And I'm not 100 percent with the feminist movement. I do agree a woman should get paid the same as a man as just about any other person. The problem I have with the feminist movement is that some women are ultra feminist, like I had one woman yell at me for holding the door open for her because she said I'm capable of opening the door myself and berated me for doing so. Shit like that is completely ridiculous when you are trying to have good manners for someone.

Who can you call on to save the day?

Why none other than...


Agent


the_stormdancer replies on 5/17/2019 12:52 pm:
See? You get it. A little bit of time and a little bit of focus and things become rather obvious (at least to me).

I am not a feminist...or not a modern one by any rate. There is far too much hate in that movement for my tastes despite what proponents decry. The day that someone gets their knickers in a twist over someone being polite is the day we really all need to look at wtf we are doing. It's gone from the sublime to the ridiculous and I can't stand it.

Thanks for ringing in!

Paulxx001 62M
8462 posts
5/17/2019 12:58 pm

just out of curiosity... what was that website, that gives you access to blogging and - 240 people who comment?!!! 🤔 😱
I have a private Mail Box on my blog, if you want to keep it quieter....

Words are like meatloaf- they can be sculpted into any shape you choose.
She asked me a question.Handcuffs Or Silk Scarves


the_stormdancer replies on 5/21/2019 9:24 pm:
It's not a secret. It's a sort of kinky version of FB called Fet...
Life...
Dawt...
Com.

Steady75423 50M
1 post
5/18/2019 10:42 am

I would like to think I live life with passion in all I do. I want the best for myself and those around me. Ecspecially those around me. If I share enough of myself to let somebody into my life, I would want the best for them. I still open doors. Enough said.


the_stormdancer replies on 5/21/2019 9:27 pm:
I've been kind of slacking on the passion levels lately...life happens...but it really is my standard on the whole. To give, to pay attention, to view people as important and to not follow any rules but my own. My profile has said that for years and I stand by those words - I always will.

You can open my door any ole day, my friend. *grins and hugs ya*

Paulxx001 62M
8462 posts
5/21/2019 9:46 pm

Thanks for the heads up.
Do you like that site? Does it work for you?

Words are like meatloaf- they can be sculpted into any shape you choose.
She asked me a question.Handcuffs Or Silk Scarves


Become a member to create a blog